<?xml version="1.0" encoding="UTF-8"?><!-- generator="wordpress/2.3" -->
<rss version="2.0"
	xmlns:content="http://purl.org/rss/1.0/modules/content/"
	xmlns:dc="http://purl.org/dc/elements/1.1/"
	>
<channel>
	<title>Comments on: Christian Indoctrination</title>
	<link>http://blogpond.com.au/2007/08/31/christian-indoctrination/</link>
	<description>Blogging with an Australian Focus</description>
	<pubDate>Fri, 12 Mar 2010 15:28:03 +0000</pubDate>
	<generator>http://wordpress.org/?v=2.3</generator>
		<item>
		<title>By: Are we indoctrinating or making disciples? &#124; missional space</title>
		<link>http://blogpond.com.au/2007/08/31/christian-indoctrination/#comment-17248</link>
		<dc:creator>Are we indoctrinating or making disciples? &#124; missional space</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 09 Sep 2009 12:09:31 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://blogpond.com.au/2007/08/31/christian-indoctrination/#comment-17248</guid>
		<description>[...] Check out this post about his experience with Christian indoctrination [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[&#8230;] Check out this post about his experience with Christian indoctrination [&#8230;]</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Rhys</title>
		<link>http://blogpond.com.au/2007/08/31/christian-indoctrination/#comment-15322</link>
		<dc:creator>Rhys</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 13 May 2009 04:57:47 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://blogpond.com.au/2007/08/31/christian-indoctrination/#comment-15322</guid>
		<description>Wow Meg's Son - you restore my faith in Oz youngsters.

Have no fear, your open minded approach to the 'most hotly argued question ever' will get you there in time. It is a journey not a dilemma, and if you keep your mind open to what your heart tells you, you will arrive and succeed.

The only real answer is subjective, because the reality of the Kingdom of Heaven can only be found in your heart - not in clinical objective analysis. When you do find the proof it will be in the form of inner conviction - and that will be unshakable by any doubt expressed by unbelievers.

Works for me............

&lt;em&gt;Rhys's last blog post..&lt;a href='http://how-to-preach.org/how-to-preach/how-to-preach/' rel="nofollow"&gt;How to Preach&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/em&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Wow Meg&#8217;s Son - you restore my faith in Oz youngsters.</p>
<p>Have no fear, your open minded approach to the &#8216;most hotly argued question ever&#8217; will get you there in time. It is a journey not a dilemma, and if you keep your mind open to what your heart tells you, you will arrive and succeed.</p>
<p>The only real answer is subjective, because the reality of the Kingdom of Heaven can only be found in your heart - not in clinical objective analysis. When you do find the proof it will be in the form of inner conviction - and that will be unshakable by any doubt expressed by unbelievers.</p>
<p>Works for me&#8230;&#8230;&#8230;&#8230;</p>
<p><em>Rhys&#8217;s last blog post..<a href='http://how-to-preach.org/how-to-preach/how-to-preach/'>How to Preach</a></em></p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Black Jeopardy</title>
		<link>http://blogpond.com.au/2007/08/31/christian-indoctrination/#comment-15068</link>
		<dc:creator>Black Jeopardy</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 26 Apr 2009 05:18:52 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://blogpond.com.au/2007/08/31/christian-indoctrination/#comment-15068</guid>
		<description>Very well articulated from the first point to the last. I will be linking you to one of my latest posts, if you dont mind :)

&lt;em&gt;Black Jeopardy's last blog post..&lt;a href='http://pokealot.blogspot.com/2009/04/dear-beloved-friends.html' rel="nofollow"&gt;Dear Beloved Friends.&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/em&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Very well articulated from the first point to the last. I will be linking you to one of my latest posts, if you dont mind <img src='http://blogpond.com.au/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':)' class='wp-smiley' /><br />
<em>Black Jeopardy&#8217;s last blog post..<a href='http://pokealot.blogspot.com/2009/04/dear-beloved-friends.html'>Dear Beloved Friends.</a></em></p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Jeanny</title>
		<link>http://blogpond.com.au/2007/08/31/christian-indoctrination/#comment-14690</link>
		<dc:creator>Jeanny</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 10 Mar 2009 06:13:34 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://blogpond.com.au/2007/08/31/christian-indoctrination/#comment-14690</guid>
		<description># Bengt; If you can keep your open mind, being able to see both (or more) sides of an issue, through life you will manage well!

I agree with this comment. Stay true to yourself!! I was raised Catholic yet I didn't understand the religion completely until I was 33 yrs old (3 years ago). When I finally understood, I convert to Christian because, to me, that was what my heart desired. Your heart will guide you in no time. Just be sure to listen to your heart very well. I applaud you for being honest with your opinion. Everybody is entitled to their own opinion. I do pray you find you way to our Lord and Jesus Christ. They're really so good.  I love you!  A.S.A.P= Always Say A Prayer!!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p># Bengt; If you can keep your open mind, being able to see both (or more) sides of an issue, through life you will manage well!</p>
<p>I agree with this comment. Stay true to yourself!! I was raised Catholic yet I didn&#8217;t understand the religion completely until I was 33 yrs old (3 years ago). When I finally understood, I convert to Christian because, to me, that was what my heart desired. Your heart will guide you in no time. Just be sure to listen to your heart very well. I applaud you for being honest with your opinion. Everybody is entitled to their own opinion. I do pray you find you way to our Lord and Jesus Christ. They&#8217;re really so good.  I love you!  A.S.A.P= Always Say A Prayer!!</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Jeff</title>
		<link>http://blogpond.com.au/2007/08/31/christian-indoctrination/#comment-12425</link>
		<dc:creator>Jeff</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 24 Sep 2008 18:15:18 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://blogpond.com.au/2007/08/31/christian-indoctrination/#comment-12425</guid>
		<description>A wonderfully written post....thanks for your efforts. Although I am not a deeply religious person I consider myself a christian.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>A wonderfully written post&#8230;.thanks for your efforts. Although I am not a deeply religious person I consider myself a christian.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Favourite Five Meme &#124; Dipping into the Blogpond</title>
		<link>http://blogpond.com.au/2007/08/31/christian-indoctrination/#comment-8202</link>
		<dc:creator>Favourite Five Meme &#124; Dipping into the Blogpond</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 11 Jan 2008 02:33:16 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://blogpond.com.au/2007/08/31/christian-indoctrination/#comment-8202</guid>
		<description>[...] Family - This isn&#8217;t about my family, but it was a guest post my son wrote about something he felt strongly about - Christian Indoctrination. [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[&#8230;] Family - This isn&#8217;t about my family, but it was a guest post my son wrote about something he felt strongly about - Christian Indoctrination. [&#8230;]</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: matt</title>
		<link>http://blogpond.com.au/2007/08/31/christian-indoctrination/#comment-6824</link>
		<dc:creator>matt</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 27 Nov 2007 23:09:16 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://blogpond.com.au/2007/08/31/christian-indoctrination/#comment-6824</guid>
		<description>Otherwise sane people doing insane things in the name of religion - yet another example in today's paper.

http://www.smh.com.au/news/national/sperm-donors-to-veto-recipients/2007/11/27/1196036893154.html

This would be funny if it wasn't actually happening. In Australia we have legislation that proposes that ....."REPRODUCTIVE donors will be able to demand their sperm or eggs only go to certain religious, ethnic or cultural groups or be reserved for heterosexual couples under government legislation expected to pass the NSW upper house today."

Sane people doing insane things....christians donors who believe in a non-existant deity called 'Yaweh' refusing their reproductive donation (egg/sperm) to prospective recipients that may beleive in another non-existant deity such as 'Allah' or who do not believe in any deity.....this is absolute madness - and what's worse is that this nonsense has actually made it to our parliamanent....I will be watching the outcome of this disgraceful state sanctioning of bigotry.. 

this is yet another example of immoral an unethical thinking emanating from a religious base...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Otherwise sane people doing insane things in the name of religion - yet another example in today&#8217;s paper.</p>
<p><a href="http://www.smh.com.au/news/national/sperm-donors-to-veto-recipients/2007/11/27/1196036893154.html">http://www.smh.com.au/news/national/sperm-donors-to-veto-recipients/2007/11/27/1196036893154.html</a></p>
<p>This would be funny if it wasn&#8217;t actually happening. In Australia we have legislation that proposes that &#8230;..&#8221;REPRODUCTIVE donors will be able to demand their sperm or eggs only go to certain religious, ethnic or cultural groups or be reserved for heterosexual couples under government legislation expected to pass the NSW upper house today.&#8221;</p>
<p>Sane people doing insane things&#8230;.christians donors who believe in a non-existant deity called &#8216;Yaweh&#8217; refusing their reproductive donation (egg/sperm) to prospective recipients that may beleive in another non-existant deity such as &#8216;Allah&#8217; or who do not believe in any deity&#8230;..this is absolute madness - and what&#8217;s worse is that this nonsense has actually made it to our parliamanent&#8230;.I will be watching the outcome of this disgraceful state sanctioning of bigotry.. </p>
<p>this is yet another example of immoral an unethical thinking emanating from a religious base&#8230;</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: matt</title>
		<link>http://blogpond.com.au/2007/08/31/christian-indoctrination/#comment-6766</link>
		<dc:creator>matt</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 26 Nov 2007 22:18:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://blogpond.com.au/2007/08/31/christian-indoctrination/#comment-6766</guid>
		<description>http://afp.google.com/article/ALeqM5gyDijXwHc1ocDU6VBdoptncFYVkA

This is a story posted yesterday (26 Nov 2007) - if the link doesn't work google "eye-gouging exorcism". It is about a girl in NZ who is recovering from emergency surgery to save her eyesight - why you ask? Well her relatives performed a Maori exorcism ceremony which involved gouging her eyes - and incidentaly her cousin also was subject to an 'exorcism and died. Yes died!! 

This is just the type of outcome religion is capable of - it's just crazy. They are not christians in this case but the same principle applies. Otherwsie sane people doing insane things in the name of religion. The 'demons' referred to in this modern day story - and also those referred to in the bible - are likely to be nothing more sinster than epilepsy or some form of mental illness. Rather than seek care from health professionals and approproate medications this poor girl is subjected to eye gouging!!!. Or in the middle ages the christians would have probably burnt this girl at the stake for being possessed by a demon or being a witch!! 

I won't add any more comments for you - i just thought it was funny that as soon as i entered a post a prime example of religious lunacy cropped up in the media that same day!! Also while i'm posting one another book i forgot to mention that you should read to give you a very good perspective on christianity - in addition to Dawkins and Hitchens - is an old book called "the bible". 

After reading Dawkins/Hitchens &#38; co I suggest actually reading what's in the bible - not just the main passsages the faithful always refer to that seem harmless but read the whole book - you will find it frightening to see the violence, the contradictions, the pointless vengence, blatant racisim and ethnic clensing, illogical anger/jealousy, blood sacrifices (human and animal) and so on and so on - it is an absolute mess. Spending some time actually reading the bible quite clearly underscores that it is not a 'divine' document in any sense - it is patently man-made and a product of its time. You or I could knock together a far more profound, more compassionate, more complete, less contradictory and more wise document in a few days....and it's no wonder we could - we know far more about the universe, the earth, mpdern evolution and medcine than biblical authors because of when we were born....

please don't let the faithful suck you in to adopting their iron age faith. They are often very nice people, and most of my own family is religious, but in the end they are misguided ...and they are unwittingly and unknowingly limiting their own life experience and they want you to join them..... 

Again good luck to you...and i hope you access wisdom from a wide array of sources rather than being sidetracked in religious faith...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><a href="http://afp.google.com/article/ALeqM5gyDijXwHc1ocDU6VBdoptncFYVkA">http://afp.google.com/article/ALeqM5gyDijXwHc1ocDU6VBdoptncFYVkA</a></p>
<p>This is a story posted yesterday (26 Nov 2007) - if the link doesn&#8217;t work google &#8220;eye-gouging exorcism&#8221;. It is about a girl in NZ who is recovering from emergency surgery to save her eyesight - why you ask? Well her relatives performed a Maori exorcism ceremony which involved gouging her eyes - and incidentaly her cousin also was subject to an &#8216;exorcism and died. Yes died!! </p>
<p>This is just the type of outcome religion is capable of - it&#8217;s just crazy. They are not christians in this case but the same principle applies. Otherwsie sane people doing insane things in the name of religion. The &#8216;demons&#8217; referred to in this modern day story - and also those referred to in the bible - are likely to be nothing more sinster than epilepsy or some form of mental illness. Rather than seek care from health professionals and approproate medications this poor girl is subjected to eye gouging!!!. Or in the middle ages the christians would have probably burnt this girl at the stake for being possessed by a demon or being a witch!! </p>
<p>I won&#8217;t add any more comments for you - i just thought it was funny that as soon as i entered a post a prime example of religious lunacy cropped up in the media that same day!! Also while i&#8217;m posting one another book i forgot to mention that you should read to give you a very good perspective on christianity - in addition to Dawkins and Hitchens - is an old book called &#8220;the bible&#8221;. </p>
<p>After reading Dawkins/Hitchens &amp; co I suggest actually reading what&#8217;s in the bible - not just the main passsages the faithful always refer to that seem harmless but read the whole book - you will find it frightening to see the violence, the contradictions, the pointless vengence, blatant racisim and ethnic clensing, illogical anger/jealousy, blood sacrifices (human and animal) and so on and so on - it is an absolute mess. Spending some time actually reading the bible quite clearly underscores that it is not a &#8216;divine&#8217; document in any sense - it is patently man-made and a product of its time. You or I could knock together a far more profound, more compassionate, more complete, less contradictory and more wise document in a few days&#8230;.and it&#8217;s no wonder we could - we know far more about the universe, the earth, mpdern evolution and medcine than biblical authors because of when we were born&#8230;.</p>
<p>please don&#8217;t let the faithful suck you in to adopting their iron age faith. They are often very nice people, and most of my own family is religious, but in the end they are misguided &#8230;and they are unwittingly and unknowingly limiting their own life experience and they want you to join them&#8230;.. </p>
<p>Again good luck to you&#8230;and i hope you access wisdom from a wide array of sources rather than being sidetracked in religious faith&#8230;</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: matt</title>
		<link>http://blogpond.com.au/2007/08/31/christian-indoctrination/#comment-6732</link>
		<dc:creator>matt</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 26 Nov 2007 02:47:47 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://blogpond.com.au/2007/08/31/christian-indoctrination/#comment-6732</guid>
		<description>To Meg's son

Firstly, that's a nice photo - I recognise it becasue I live in the suburb you've shown in a street right next to the soccer field!! And I can guess the school you're referring to is probablythe one over the bridge on the right of your photo. 

I think indoctrination of any kind - christianity, judaism, islam or even atheism/humanism - is reprehensible. And i'm sorry to hear what happened to you. Misguided parents believe they are doing the right thing by introduing their kids to religion and 'instilling morals' but what they are actually doing is forcing their own religious beliefs on to their child at a time when they will uncrtically accept anything they are told - and in the end this indoctrination can only ever be temproary becasue when the child approaches adulthood they will form their own views and make up their own mind. Parents should leave their kids to make up their minds as adults - indoctrinating kids is a socially acceptable form of child abuse

Morality needs no divine permission - in fact it is more often the case that immorality proceeds from divine authority (the Crusades where christains burned 'witches' at the stake, christain shooting doctors at abortion clinics, muslims flying planes into buildings, Mormons refusing thier children life-saving blood transfusions and so on and so on).

I strongly suggest you YouTube authors like Richard Dawkins, Christopher Hitchens, Sam Harris and Ayaan Hirsi Ali top hear very interesting debates on belief. And also of course buy their books if you can. YouTube is an excellent way to hear these great thinkers and orators at the click of a mouse and with no expense/delay. 

You are obviously independent enough not to succumb to religious pressures thus far - however from your note it seems you are unaware of the pitfalls of belief and the huge negatives of subscribing the religous superstition - the guilt and the watsed energy. You seem open to religious belief. 

The religious instructors at your school beleive all non-christians (i.e. most of the planet) are destioned for an eternity of suffering for not accepting their religion's message. Of course they gloss over the facts that most of the planet has never even heard their message, and never will - and they also conveniently gloss over the fact that we (humans as a species) pre-date christainity by at least 98,000 years (and maybe up to 248,000 years). Try to do the sums on past/present/future people damned for an eternity for not even hearing the message and it staggers the mind!! So even if you accept that there is a God, it would seem montrous if the christains claims are correct - and that eternal well being rests solely when/where you are born!!! Soelly on hearing the christain message - and accepting it!! Nonsense... 

In any event, there are many many water proof arguments against believing the Christian god story - and in your schooling you would not have been exposed to the various dark/disturbing passages from the bible are never mentioned by the faithful. I just suggest to you not to swallow their god story whole and just take some of the postives from it but also seek wisdom from other sources, including form non-religious writers and commentators. 

If you can read 'The God Delusion' (Dawkins) and 'God is not Great' (Hitchens) - it would be well worth your while investing the small amount of time taken to read these books before aligning yourself to a life-time of adherence to any faith. My theory is that people like simplicity - they want all their answers in one book, one doctrine, one religion, one person, one deity - but I suspect there is much more to be had from life than that. I think accepting any one religion or way of thinking is very limiting and I hope this would not be the path you choose. 

Good luck to you</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>To Meg&#8217;s son</p>
<p>Firstly, that&#8217;s a nice photo - I recognise it becasue I live in the suburb you&#8217;ve shown in a street right next to the soccer field!! And I can guess the school you&#8217;re referring to is probablythe one over the bridge on the right of your photo. </p>
<p>I think indoctrination of any kind - christianity, judaism, islam or even atheism/humanism - is reprehensible. And i&#8217;m sorry to hear what happened to you. Misguided parents believe they are doing the right thing by introduing their kids to religion and &#8216;instilling morals&#8217; but what they are actually doing is forcing their own religious beliefs on to their child at a time when they will uncrtically accept anything they are told - and in the end this indoctrination can only ever be temproary becasue when the child approaches adulthood they will form their own views and make up their own mind. Parents should leave their kids to make up their minds as adults - indoctrinating kids is a socially acceptable form of child abuse</p>
<p>Morality needs no divine permission - in fact it is more often the case that immorality proceeds from divine authority (the Crusades where christains burned &#8216;witches&#8217; at the stake, christain shooting doctors at abortion clinics, muslims flying planes into buildings, Mormons refusing thier children life-saving blood transfusions and so on and so on).</p>
<p>I strongly suggest you YouTube authors like Richard Dawkins, Christopher Hitchens, Sam Harris and Ayaan Hirsi Ali top hear very interesting debates on belief. And also of course buy their books if you can. YouTube is an excellent way to hear these great thinkers and orators at the click of a mouse and with no expense/delay. </p>
<p>You are obviously independent enough not to succumb to religious pressures thus far - however from your note it seems you are unaware of the pitfalls of belief and the huge negatives of subscribing the religous superstition - the guilt and the watsed energy. You seem open to religious belief. </p>
<p>The religious instructors at your school beleive all non-christians (i.e. most of the planet) are destioned for an eternity of suffering for not accepting their religion&#8217;s message. Of course they gloss over the facts that most of the planet has never even heard their message, and never will - and they also conveniently gloss over the fact that we (humans as a species) pre-date christainity by at least 98,000 years (and maybe up to 248,000 years). Try to do the sums on past/present/future people damned for an eternity for not even hearing the message and it staggers the mind!! So even if you accept that there is a God, it would seem montrous if the christains claims are correct - and that eternal well being rests solely when/where you are born!!! Soelly on hearing the christain message - and accepting it!! Nonsense&#8230; </p>
<p>In any event, there are many many water proof arguments against believing the Christian god story - and in your schooling you would not have been exposed to the various dark/disturbing passages from the bible are never mentioned by the faithful. I just suggest to you not to swallow their god story whole and just take some of the postives from it but also seek wisdom from other sources, including form non-religious writers and commentators. </p>
<p>If you can read &#8216;The God Delusion&#8217; (Dawkins) and &#8216;God is not Great&#8217; (Hitchens) - it would be well worth your while investing the small amount of time taken to read these books before aligning yourself to a life-time of adherence to any faith. My theory is that people like simplicity - they want all their answers in one book, one doctrine, one religion, one person, one deity - but I suspect there is much more to be had from life than that. I think accepting any one religion or way of thinking is very limiting and I hope this would not be the path you choose. </p>
<p>Good luck to you</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Raven</title>
		<link>http://blogpond.com.au/2007/08/31/christian-indoctrination/#comment-4142</link>
		<dc:creator>Raven</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 10 Sep 2007 02:51:42 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://blogpond.com.au/2007/08/31/christian-indoctrination/#comment-4142</guid>
		<description>Good for you Meg.

Spent my high school years at CCHS.  Know what you are talking about.  I was the penticostal preachers kid at the baptist school.  So I was the happy clappy.  Tell you what, I would rather have been the non believer.

Keep thinking and writing, it is working for you.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Good for you Meg.</p>
<p>Spent my high school years at CCHS.  Know what you are talking about.  I was the penticostal preachers kid at the baptist school.  So I was the happy clappy.  Tell you what, I would rather have been the non believer.</p>
<p>Keep thinking and writing, it is working for you.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
</channel>
</rss>
